After Zara does her Tudors wrap-up and before we're transported to Wonderland by MissKiki I'd love to pop up a new version of Kensington in a more modern era (think the 1980s so not completely contemporary) but this time as a co-ed boarding school under an (obviously) new headmaster who has reluctantly re-opened the doors of the manor for this purpose.

Dare wrote

After Zara does her Tudors wrap-up and before we're transported to Wonderland by MissKiki I'd love to pop up a new version of Kensington in a more modern era (think the 1980s so not completely contemporary) but this time as a co-ed boarding school under an (obviously) new headmaster who has reluctantly re-opened the doors of the manor for this purpose.

Definitely count me in.

Dare wrote

After Zara does her Tudors wrap-up and before we're transported to Wonderland by MissKiki I'd love to pop up a new version of Kensington in a more modern era (think the 1980s so not completely contemporary) but this time as a co-ed boarding school under an (obviously) new headmaster who has reluctantly re-opened the doors of the manor for this purpose.

Yes, please! I will try to join for sure

Hi hi hi!

2020 is heading into series finale & I'm usually the most inspired during worst times - which means: inspiration.

So I'd like to do something along the lines of a murder mystery x small-town energy x character-driven drama one-shot contest with a very clear beginning and end (meaning, one-season in this universe). The plan is to do a character claim tomorrow which will last only a couple days.

Would anyone be interested?

While I dig the contest idea (and that of more one-shots), I'm scrambling for uni at the moment (or very much should be) and knowing myself I, sadly, can't allow myself the distraction. But I hope you idea comes to life!

Hope you can make it to character claim at least, I'm not going to be able to pull this off for a bit & I doubt anyone is gonna be able to do anything during this weird holiday season tbh

Also, I'm curious if Dare is planning on hosting Kensington - I'm still up for that

Oh, then I misunderstood, I thought you had the idea to host it now. When did you have in mind for the contest to go up?

At the earliest time slot convenient, which might be hard to tell right now.

Zaralee your contest idea sounds great and I'm obviously a fan of a character claim so I'm in.

I'd still love to pop up something for Kensignton BUT I don't want to run into the next contest inadvertently. Does MissKiki have a specific start date for Surviving Wonderland?

Dare wrote

Zaralee your contest idea sounds great and I'm obviously a fan of a character claim so I'm in.

I'd still love to pop up something for Kensignton BUT I don't want to run into the next contest inadvertently. Does MissKiki have a specific start date for Surviving Wonderland?

Happy to hear you say that! I might post the claim tonight
Mind you, it will not be as intricate as Fae-tal Folly, but hopefully we can have fun too

Also, still excited about Kensington! If MissKiki knows her dates, that'd be awesome!

Zaralee wrote

Happy to hear you say that! I might post the claim tonight
Mind you, it will not be as intricate as Fae-tal Folly, but hopefully we can have fun too

Also, still excited about Kensington! If MissKiki knows her dates, that'd be awesome!

Ofc I'll find time to tinker something into a charcter Zaralee !

And I haven't said it before, but I think Kensington in the 80s is an awesome idea. At this time though I would just have to deal with my fomo, or if it doesn't fit the schedule I would look forward to join in the spring!

MissKiki was kind enough to reach out to me and I could try and make a shorter version of Kensington in the 80s work (5 rounds each 3 days) but the reality is it may make more sense to just wait for a proper opening since I'm not totally sure how I'd retool it...I looked on the Calendar and while Nina is set to host a 6 round contest with a pre-contest in March after that the next context isn't scheduled until June.

Would everyone be okay revising Kensington in early-mid April or early May depending on how long exactly Nina's Glam & Glitter takes?

Hi, I'm back once again *awkwardly waves*

I know I keep coming and going and was completely uncommitted, but a lot of stuff has happened (I'm not going to go into details, but I got covid and a lot of family stuff with possible police involvement has happened) and whilst before I thought writing would only add to the mental drain, I've not realised it might be the thing to keep me sane.

Okay, pity party and explanations over. I'm back and I'll try to keep up.

Loving the ideas I've seen so far. Honestly very excited for another Kensington contest.

Missed you guys 

Last edited by Fashion-Chic (02/01/2021 at 17:45)

Fashion-Chic wrote

Hi, I'm back once again *awkwardly waves*

I know I keep coming and going and was completely uncommitted, but a lot of stuff has happened (I'm not going to go into details, but I got covid and a lot of family stuff with possible police involvement has happened) and whilst before I thought writing would only add to the mental drain, I've not realised it might be the thing to keep me sane.

Okay, pity party and explanations over. I'm back and I'll try to keep up.

Loving the ideas I've seen so far. Honestly very excited for another Kensington contest.

Missed you guys 

Sorry about all of the sucky stuff going on and I'm glad that you're back. I'm super excited for the new contests too and I hope that Kensington lives up to the hype when the doors reopen in May.

Can we all take a minute and consider the lengths of some of the SWCs?

I looked on the upcoming calendar and between casting round/pre games, 5 day rounds and special permissions for 6 round contests we have at least two upcoming ones (which I believe are back to back) that are going to take between 30 and 35 days apiece and that's IF everything runs smoothly and there's no need for an extension. 30-35 days 1) a long time to ask someone to commit to participation (I know I've personally had some things happen in real life in the last couple of months that threw my world for a loop) and 2) because of the unspoken "rule" where there's generally only one swc at a time it creates a lot of dead space if there are players who are uninterested in a particular contest storyline or who may be unavailable when one that's meant to last a while starts.

I know that I've personally done pre-contest stuff like character claims so I'm NOT going to be a hypocrite and suggest that we try to stop doing those things completely what I am asking though is the following if you've hosted in the past or are thinking about hosting:

1) Can you think about whether or not your contest actually needs a pre-game component or "casting" round in most instances the info that's being asked for at that point (Name, age, backstory etc.) will fit into round 1.

2) Before asking Emmy for special permission ask if your context really needs 6 rounds OR if you feel like it absolutely has to have that many rounds is there a way to make them more focused so that they can take place over the span of 3 days instead of over the span of 5 days. (As a sidebar it may be helpful if we were able to do contests that had varying round length but that's a chat for another time).

3) We all have different strengths/storytelling styles would we be open to trying to have 2 contests posted at the same time? If so maybe we could pair up hosts that have different ideas or layouts, or round times, or complexity levels and then stagger the contests e.g. contest a would open on a Wednesday and then contest b could open the following Sunday or Monday. This would create greater variety.

I appreciate that you bring this up and I think you make valid points. Since I’ve thought about it a bit myself this became quite long:

As someone who participate in SWCs as a contestant, I almost always find myself tiring around round 4. This has mostly nothing to do with the story itself but the fact that, even if I do it for the fun of it, it’s a lot to commit to in time and energy continuing for a whole month (which more or less it is). For me five rounds instead of six, makes a big difference although I would more than welcome contests with fewer rounds! Or with the rounds coming separate, one a time or in twos or threes, alike to what Zara is doing with HC, as long as they keep coming regularly.

I like the idea of these ‘casting rounds/character claims’ which have come into favour. In my opinion they work best being something lighter and separate from the contest as a whole – not just a ‘Round 0’. Being so, then I don’t object to a separate casting overlapping with the ongoing contest, that way both the next host and contestants can prepare for the upcoming contest and it would speed up the process.

I’m not too keen on the idea of overlapping contests (as I have vowed to myself never doing multiple contests at once again, it would mean more picking and choosing when I’d rather do both). The only objective thought I have about overlapping is that it would thin out the participants further, since there hasn’t been many in the last contests, if that is a timing issue or an overall one, I don’t know. Then again, I can see there might be a need for it, especially with potentially a lot of upcoming second seasons, perhaps with some planning and coordination it would work!

And while on the topic of second seasons, this might go a bit off topic but I would ask hosts to consider keeping each contest to a full story-arch, that there is some form of resolution at the end of the last round. Especially since at the speed we are going there is a year between the first and the second season. That, or state at the beginning of the contest that the story-arch spans over multiple contests, in my opinion it kind of trumps the fun to go through four rounds of build up only to realise at round 5 that I’ll have to wait another year for anything to come of it. This is nothing against multiple seasons per see, just to keep a whole story-arch in each contest, there can of course be an overall arch over the multiple seasons too (also this way, if the next season doesn’t come about the contestants are still left some resolution), I hope that makes sense.

I’d like to say, to everyone and no one in particular, that what I enjoy so much (and I enjoy it a lot) about the SWCs are that they are commutative storytelling, the story is composed together. For the greatest SWCs, both hosts and contestants need to take each other into consideration. I look forward to enjoy more writing with you all!

Dare wrote

Can we all take a minute and consider the lengths of some of the SWCs?

I looked on the upcoming calendar and between casting round/pre games, 5 day rounds and special permissions for 6 round contests we have at least two upcoming ones (which I believe are back to back) that are going to take between 30 and 35 days apiece and that's IF everything runs smoothly and there's no need for an extension. 30-35 days 1) a long time to ask someone to commit to participation (I know I've personally had some things happen in real life in the last couple of months that threw my world for a loop) and 2) because of the unspoken "rule" where there's generally only one swc at a time it creates a lot of dead space if there are players who are uninterested in a particular contest storyline or who may be unavailable when one that's meant to last a while starts.

I know that I've personally done pre-contest stuff like character claims so I'm NOT going to be a hypocrite and suggest that we try to stop doing those things completely what I am asking though is the following if you've hosted in the past or are thinking about hosting:

1) Can you think about whether or not your contest actually needs a pre-game component or "casting" round in most instances the info that's being asked for at that point (Name, age, backstory etc.) will fit into round 1.

2) Before asking Emmy for special permission ask if your context really needs 6 rounds OR if you feel like it absolutely has to have that many rounds is there a way to make them more focused so that they can take place over the span of 3 days instead of over the span of 5 days. (As a sidebar it may be helpful if we were able to do contests that had varying round length but that's a chat for another time).

3) We all have different strengths/storytelling styles would we be open to trying to have 2 contests posted at the same time? If so maybe we could pair up hosts that have different ideas or layouts, or round times, or complexity levels and then stagger the contests e.g. contest a would open on a Wednesday and then contest b could open the following Sunday or Monday. This would create greater variety.

Here is my 20 cents, sprinkled with a possible dose of unpopular opinion...


For me personally, I found that I just needed a break altogether. I found that I was losing interest in what I was writing and thought maybe it was because I was just doing too much. I have also noticed that a lot of the people that were highly active when the story contests started back up have now stopped participating all together. Perhaps due to burn out or just conflicting RL schedules/responsibilities... could be that everyone has become so bored with computer life after having to live a year of basically living/interacting with other people virtually due to the pandemic. Who knows.

I had intentions to join the last contest (Wonderland) but when it rolled out I just couldn't wrap my head around what to write. I think this happens to people at times. Unfortunately, it was just bad timing for me personally to be a part of the last contest (and sadly a couple before that but I was not cognitive of my writers fatigue at the time)...

CASTING ROUNDS:
IMO these need to make sense or have some impact on the story. Why are we doing casting? Does it impact the story or is it just a way to extend out a contest just because everyone else did it? If you need a casting in order to set up your story then by all means please do it... If you do not need the information to prepare anything for the story then it is just a basic writing round... no one is being eliminated from writing in the main story so if this information is not impacting the story why does there need to be a whole 'extra' round for it. Most of the time these casting rounds can just be part of the round 1 information.

MULTIPLE CONTESTS RUNNING TOGETHER:
I personally think that having multiple contests running concurrently is a double-edged sword. On the one hand, it would be great to have options... but on the other hand if I like both options being offered at one time would I take the risk to join both or sacrifice one over the other? At this point, its been 4 rounds of the current contest and I am feeling like I would like to write again but its far too late for me to get involved in the current contest at this point. So I am stuck waiting for it to end and seeing if the next option will be something I am interested in doing. And if it is not then I am left having to wait another month before another option is available.

PARTICIPATION:
I do not know what the solution is but I do agree that it does seem (from my perspective) that a lot of the contestants seem to fizzle out in these contests around the 3rd/4th round and that the last 1-2 rounds are running at low participation. I have also noticed that the hosts are becoming less interested in their own contests based on the participation level (or so it seems). Impressions take days to be posted leaving the writers that are participating very limited time to post anything then the whole timing goes into disarray.

HOSTING:
I can understand, again from my perspective, I remember when I hosted my first contest I felt rather deflated when the participation level dwindled down however I think as hosts we owe it to those that are continuing to participate a sort of respect to either continue with the same enthusiasm we had going in or if you simply cannot find it in you to do that then you should shut the whole thing down. It's really not fair to the people that are trying to participate and are submitting their entries on time for the host to not uphold their end of the bargain. The host sets the standard for the contest in terms of quality and timing.

MULTIPLE SEASONS:
Lastly, I agree with Tricole regarding the multiple season contests. Don't think I need to go into any detail here, she wrapped it up pretty nicely.

I do hope no one takes offense to anything I have said, I am just pointing out my own observations and in part experiences. I do not mean anything personally towards anyone. If I am too harsh or too whatever I apologize and hope that everyone feels comfortable voicing their opinions as well. I think the best way for everyone to proceed is by being open and communicative so that we can all be sure we are having as much fun as possible with all this.

tricole and BambiFoxx you both make great points.

Casting rounds

Can we all agree that if for some reason a host feels like this is necessary that rather than creating a round 0 which essentially turns a 5 round contest into a 6 round contest that they post a separate thread e.g. a character claim or a character introduction? I think that this is honestly the most fair way to do this since as Bambi pointed out most of the time the stuff included in these rounds can be a part of round 1.

Overlapping contests

After your feedback I still think this could work but only if there were clear parameters e.g. one of the contests was light, one of the contests had fewer rounds (no more than 3) and both hosts were open to the idea. For example I have a lot of RL stuff going on right now and based on how things shake out I may not have the mental space or time to host a full blown Kensington revival in May but I'd love to be able to do a fun, quick 3 round contest (15 days max.) in early March just to get back into hosting.

Participation

Both Tricole and Bambi make great points about the round 4 slump and I think that from a hosting perspective those of us with upcoming contests need to think about if we can make our stories more succinct because while we put a lot of work into worldbuilding it's the contestants who make those worlds truly come alive.

Hosting

Warning that this is going to be an unpopular opinion: I think that part of the reason for delays is that sometimes there's too much information provided. I know that when I host reading the stories and writing the impressions can take a couple of hours so I can only imagine how much time is invested for hosts who are doing that plus posting things like character snippets and super in depth world information a lot of which (from what I can tell anyway) takes place "off camera" and away from the stories that the contestants are writing OR in some cases strips them of their agency or centralizes extras. All of this does a disservice to the people who take the time to participate and isn't fair to them because it makes the writing/story of the host more important than the contestants. I think that rather than doing these round by round if you really want to tell these side stories about your characters that they can be posted as a part of the epilogue which doesn't delay round by round play.

Multiple Seasons

My suggestion (and we'll likely need to bring in Emmy for this) is to have a separate thread within the SWC forum for the different "worlds" that hosts revisit. In doing this I think that each host who plans on multiple seasons can create a main thread introducing the world and it's basic rules and characters while also providing contestants a single place to ask questions. After each season the host can choose to do a re-cap (I think this will help since there can be significant RL time between seasons) and before each new season they can post any new info (new characters, important changes etc.) which will also help to facilitate things like time jumps.

Jumping in, shortly!

Great points were made & all I can do is offer my own perspective with some previous experience.

Casting Rounds
Nothing to add: if there's a valid reason to have round zero, go for it.
What I would like to add is that the rest of the people hosting would appreciate heads up, too.

Overlapping contests
Can be sustainable, I feel, if hosts agree on it? I'm afraid the only issue will be with writers here - but currently, we're okay, I feel.

Participation
I agree with all that's been said, and want to add this: in my opinion, part of this slump comes from expectations. I cannot speak for everyone but from my experience, everyone comes with their own idea of the story, how things should work out, amount of spotlight & their own perspective on everything in the contest. At times, there is a gap between what host is going for and what contestants feel they are getting, so I believe a bit of slum comes from that too.

Hosting
Oh, okay. I like world-building, and the contests I do are not everyone's cup of tea. I try to make sure everyone is included to the extent they say they would like to be included, they have things to do, and I change a lot of things according to what contestants do. I put a lot of effort into things I do here, back-stories to give you the reasoning behind some actions, or simply an insight into extras.
It also takes me a lot of time to go through stories (not a complaint, btw), and time to pen out the individual bits for everyone.
It also takes time to talk to contestants about all the things above, so I have no issue with 5-day rounds or even 6-day rounds, because I honestly do try to get everything done in the shortest time possible.

Multi-rounds
It's a good idea to create this separate thing. I feel this type of contest is not popular here, and while I personally like it, maybe there won't be any needs to open a separate thread for only a handful things?

Now, I'm gonna move out my contest out of the calendar for the moment.
HC one-round might happen as scheduled, but by the looks of things right now, I will not have time to host anything else I wanted (apartment renovation, moving, work season is about to begin).

Most of the points have been said by now, so I'll try to keep this short with the few bits I want to say without turning it into another treatise on how SWCs should be hosted.

Casting
I can give or take these. I've never made it a secret I'm not a fan of character claims - if I join up, I want a character that's my own. But I also recognise the necessity of them: to split characters into factions, get some basic information done, or - one of my preferred ways, to get the "Let's introduce me to EVERYONE" over and done with. That way, I can  hop into a contest straight into the action.

Concurrent contests
Personally? I don't care, but I know I'd stick to only one contest. But I also remember how much hurt feelings there were when there were two SWCs running, and one contest had more participants than the other. So, good idea in theory, so-so in practice. Also, this is a personal thing: if I see a contest I don't feel like joining, I take it like a break. Helps prevent burnout... as I've learnt the hard way a LONG time ago in the past.

Hosting
Specifically, the information given to hosting. It's a hard line to balance: you want to build enough so contestants know the world they're in, but you don't want to overload them.  Call me a traditionalist, but I firmly sit in the camp of not pulling things from my ass and then telling contestants "Oh, it happened off-stage" OR "so this contestant got this, but you didn't, so you don't have this information. Sorry!"

Everyone should have a fair shot at the information. And everyone deserves to know the context of an NPC's actions, so that no one can be accused of going OOC or writing something and then asking why their character's actions led them to getting a certain reaction, potentially resulting in a very huffy exit. Hypothetically speaking.

So, TL;DR: I very much disagree that posting things like character snippets and world information strips contestants of their agency or centralizes extras. I see it as a way to avoid conflict, to set things out, and set boundaries. Makes it fun for everyone, not just focusing on one or two main contestants.

Multiple Seasons
I don't think we need multiple sections. EmmyAna already has enough on her plate, and LaF is already running on bare maintenance. It'd only be more work for her. Recapping, however, I'm fine with. The "main threads" can go into Creative Arts, as Zaralee and MistyMisty have already done.

Last thoughts
Really though? I don't really think we should prescribe how other people host. There are a lot of people trying out hosting, and a lot of people trying out participating. Should there be shorter contests? Absolutely, so there's something for everyone - even newcomers, who might be a tad intimidated by some of the longer-form contests here. But I don't think it's worth worrying about how other people run their contests, how much a host writes, and how much it seems to shift spotlight away from your character. At the end of the day, the story is for yourself, and the interaction, after all.

That's it, really. Apologies for the brusqueness - I've come out from several 12 hour long workdays and I've not been able to string things together nicely.

Also, to cap out: I'm removing Hotel Charelli from the calendar for the time being as well. I'll... replace it. Eventually.

Last edited by Jadis (09/02/2021 at 16:55)

I just wanted to step in briefly once more just to admit that I am saddened to see that contests are coming off the calendar at this point.

I'd also just like to remark that just because one person doesn't like a particular style doesn't mean that others feel the same way. It's okay for people to not agree about this but I did not get the feeling that anyone was trying to dictate hosting styles. And if so, they really shouldn't. Everyone is unique in a wonderful way and I would hate for contests to be all cookie-cutter.

At any rate, this is a forum for us to discuss opinions/ideas which may include suggestions and critiques but I hate to feel that commenting here could ruin anyone's motivation to write/host. Agree/disagree but I think honest open communication is a great thing and no one should feel that their opinion is invalid or unappreciated. There is only one way for anyone to know what we are feeling and that is for us to share it.

First, as a matter of clarity my posts have not been attempts at trying to police how other people host their contests, they're opinions that I hoped would start a discussion, not veiled attacks or attempts to be the boss of anything or anyone. I'd thought that was clear but just in case it wasn't I sincerely apologize. My feeling is "do you" (both as a host and in general) and I mean that with zero snark or sarcasm. If I overstepped in making the suggestions I did then I apologize for that as well.

Second, if something I said caused anyone to cancel their contests that was never my intent. I apologize for that as well.

With all of that said, I'm just going to sit back and shut up now.

I think we’ve all made our intentions clear enough with our posts. As BambiFoxx had said, communication is key, and there’s not much point saying one thing when you mean another.

Unfortunately, being text only and note emoticon-ing makes anything neutral sounding or well-meaning... uh. Difficult to interpret, let’s just put it that way.

As on the contest cancellation front: Zaralee’s made it clear she has more pressing RL obligations. Likewise, my current schedule makes it impossible to host anything - or join anything - till it eases up. So I don’t think there’s a need to feel sad about it: they’ll come back, when everyone’s not insanely busy.

Last edited by Jadis (10/02/2021 at 01:50)

Jadis wrote

Unfortunately, being text only and note emoticon-ing makes anything neutral sounding or well-meaning... uh. Difficult to interpret, let’s just put it that way.

Quite well said, thank you Jadis. 

I believe everyone's opinion, whether we agree with it or not, is necessary for the overall discourse. Some of us may be a little rougher around the edges than others, some a little more zealous to voice our opinions than others but in order to keep this place fun and entertaining for all of us it is important that everyone feel free enough to say how they honestly feel. Everything that has been said so far (about the contests) has both made me feel not quite so alone in some of my own opinions while also giving me additional things to think about from additional views offered. I, for one, appreciate the conversation for what it is, an opportunity to share and to see what others are thinking/feeling.

Communication is good - it might be a bit rough or, perhaps not rough, but without the desire to be sugarcoated. So, let's keep the conversation going.

I did not feel Dare, BambiFoxx nor tricole said anything that made me push my contests further down the line. I'm in the middle of a huge renovation of an apartment built in the early '70s (popcorn ceiling and all), with a months deadline to move out of my current place & work is not being kind either. So, instead of hosting half-heartedly, I would rather not host at all. And even if it's not my place, I can say Jadis is really working (at) ungodly hours & CH has been on hold for a while because of the intricacy of the concept & the contest itself.

When it comes to different opinions on the style of hosting, or the extent of world-building, or multi-season, I honestly cannot help it.

I like to imagine plot arcs that might run a bit longer, I love to create worlds, I like to imagine repeating extras, I love love love giving them history to match those of the people contestants write and get them to feel layered.
And, I always stop myself at a point in order not to be too much, since there's always more I could add. I appreciate those who join tremendously & want to dedicate the same amount of effort to them.

That said, I will again say it's quite normal that this type of insanity not to be everyone's cup of tea.

I'll jump in with this:
Hemlock Cove will be continued, soon, because it's important to keep the momentum (ish).
And also, for those who might have missed, or are wondering: Hemlock Cove holds a huge potential for me personally and it feels like part of some universe. A small town with a lot going on, circles that can be visited as part of different contests - I have some ideas I would love to play out, eventually.